The Estimated Cost of Illegal Immigration

[Rose]

And yet you said "most" scientist." Weird that you would know their names.
oh gawd. Yes, the US was Communist. No, seeking to have government control who private companies can and cannot hire is communistic.

Then I have found out I am a communist.

I always thought it was protectionism or isolationism. Oh, well, I like my ideas.

So do you think half a billion would be too much population- two billion? Shouldn't someone in government be thinking about it- talking about it? News media, someone?

 

[Observer]

[FONT=TIMES,SERIF]Do you think higher population is better? If so, why[/FONT]

I have no opinion on as to the optimal population. I do tend to think that the market-place will fix the population at just the right amount. Prices have the tendency to control "over population."

 

[Observer]

So do you think half a billion would be too much population- two billion? Shouldn't someone in government be thinking about it- talking about it? News media, someone?

Sure, I guess. But I tend to think that free-markets (capitalism) will solve any of these problems. Of course, that means we need less incentives to encourage people to have more kids than they can afford without the aid of government.

 

[Rose]

I have no opinion on as to the optimal population. I do tend to think that the market-place will fix the population at just the right amount. Prices have the tendency to control "over population."

Why do you trust the market place theory?

 

[Observer]

Why do you trust the market place theory?

It sounds plausible. What you're suggesting is often called "protectionism," but the truth is that it is mercantilistic and it helps only a certain segment of the population to the detriment of the greater population.

Similar to when US auto makers howled for tariffs on the Japanese imposts. The consumer got over-priced and inferior products, while the US auto industry got a governmental incentive to continue to make crappy cars. The auto industry was the only group protected--the consumer got the shaft.

 

[Rose]

It sounds plausible. What you're suggesting is often called "protectionism," but the truth is that it is mercantilistic and it helps only a certain segment of the population to the detriment of the greater population.

The same could be said for outsourcing and massive immigration IMO.

 

[Observer]

The same could be said for outsourcing and massive immigration IMO.

Difference (and a big difference) is that people are free to make these choices. No one's freedom is infringed upon in allowing more immigration or outsourcing.

 

[Rose]

Difference (and a big difference) is that people are free to make these choices. No one's freedom is infringed upon in allowing more immigration or outsourcing.

Then why aren't they free to bring in people from China to work in the US for a few dollars a day?

 

[Observer]

Then why aren't they free to bring in people from China to work in the US for a few dollars a day?

Who are "they"?

 

[Rose]

Difference (and a big difference) is that people are free to make these choices. No one's freedom is infringed upon in allowing more immigration or outsourcing.

People aren't free from losing their job to outsourcing, to not have their wages remain stagnant as the dollar falls, to be replaced by someone from India who will work for half their salary, to have their school taxes rise as schools are needed for immigrant's children, etc.

 

[Rose]

Who are "they"?

Employers. If they can do it in China with freedom, why not here?

 

[Observer]

People aren't free from losing their job to outsourcing,

Of course, no one is guaranteed a job. Workers have to compete for jobs, and it sounds to me that many here are bitching because they are losing in the free job-market.

 

[Observer]

Employers. If they can do it in China with freedom, why not here?

Why would employers bring anyone? It's more cost effective to employ those who freely come to them. In this case, Mexicans tend to fill that role. If it was cost effective, I'm sure more Chinese would come here on their own.

 

[Rose]

Why would employers bring anyone? It's more cost effective to employ those who freely come to them. In this case, Mexicans tend to fill that role. If it was cost effective, I'm sure more Chinese would come here on their own.

I am more for the US worker. Not all the excessive freedom for the employer. So I could never believe your way.

I met a man from New Orleans who had lived there all his life. When Katrina happened he stayed there and was working to clean it up. He thought he wouldn't have to leave. Then one day trucks started pulling up with Mexicans and the boss told him, The Mexicans have come, we won't be needing you anymore. The man is now homeless and living in my town in Texas where he was bussed and dumped. True story.

I have other examples but must go night night.

 

[Observer]

I am more for the US worker. Not all the excessive freedom for the employer. So I could never believe your way.

I understand. I am for freedom and personal responsibility and personal accountability, so I could never believe your way .

And yes, I'm sure then man from New Orleans inability to keep a job is the fault of a truck full of Mexicans. Maybe he was also abused by an alcoholic father who never hugged him, a mother who was incapable of showing love, and a host of other excuses from the excuse jar.

*tear*

 

[Rose]

I understand. I am for freedom and personal responsibility and personal accountability, so I could never believe your way .

And yes, I'm sure then man from New Orleans inability to keep a job is the fault of a truck full of Mexicans. Maybe he was also abused by an alcoholic father who never hugged him, and a mother who was incapable of showing love.

*tear*

Yep, that's right, trucks full of Mexicans. Lots of people were brought here from New Orleans- saying the same thing. Mexicans were hired instead of locals and they slept in bunks inside the trucks.

 

[Observer]

Yep, that's right, trucks full of Mexicans. Lots of people were brought here from New Orleans- saying the same thing. Mexicans were hired instead of locals and they slept in bunks inside the trucks.

Looks like the employers hire those who they felt would do the job more efficiently.
Inefficient workers would be better off learning how to become more competitive in their industry than crying about it. Of course, that's just my opinion.

 

[Rose]

Looks like the employers hire those who they felt would do the job more efficiently.
Inefficient workers would be better off learning how to become more competitive in their industry than crying about it. Of course, that's just my opinion.

Well, it's my opinion too that they be able to hire the most efficient workers, just make it among their own citizenry. And that's just my opinion.

 

[Observer]

Well, it's my opinion too that they be able to hire the most efficient workers, just make it among their own citizenry. And that's just my opinion.

Well, no offense, but your opinion obviously didn't mean anything in that situation. It was the employers' opinion which--and should be--counted.
But I know there are those who just cant wait to tell others who to run their business, and sometimes the succeed in subverting capitalism and freedom.
A shame.

 

[Rose]

Well, no offense, but your opinion obviously didn't mean anything in that situation. It was the employers' opinion which--and should be--counted.
But I know there are those who just cant wait to tell others who to run their business, and sometimes the succeed in subverting capitalism and freedom.
A shame.

Our difference is that I don't believe in unchecked totally global capitalism. I don't equate it with all "freedom". Again I believe businesses should be in their own nation and hire from their own citizenry and the freedom should come from there.