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They are all hard working people!

^ well opinion pages of San Francisco Chronicle are not the links I provided. I provided links to the health and national news pages. The link you provided criticizes the opinion pages of the SF Chronicle.

Man, the links you provide are getting weirder and weirder. dood, you love that fringe life eh? come on man. don't go timothy mcveigh on us. he loved that fringe life too.
 
^ well opinion pages of San Francisco Chronicle are not the links I provided. I provided links to the health and national news pages. The link you provided criticizes the opinion pages of the SF Chronicle.

Man, the links you provide are getting weirder and weirder. dood, you love that fringe life eh? come on man. don't go timothy mcveigh on us. he loved that fringe life too.


linkS, look at the linkS. The SF Chronicle is famous for it's inaccurate information and it's liberal bias- it can hardly be called a tower of truth.
Let me know when you have something real, wasting my time with you is no longer fun. Anyone with a brain here can see that you are no match for me in this "debate".
This site is 98% pro illegal immigrant and anti "whitey" and yet not one person has supported anything you have said.
 
so truthbtold,

So do you have any links that show that the bay area has higher health care costs than the national average?

I provided links to a study that was shown in the SF Chronicle, LA Times, NY Times, Washington Post, that showed that the bay area had lower health care costs than the national average, even though the bay area has a large amount of immigrants Americans.

Do you have any links that prove otherwise?

If not, be a man, sack up and accept the hard cold fact. Stop providing links to timothy mcveigh websites, because you are just showing your ignorance more and more by basing your arguments on shoddy links and no evidence. Its anti American to hate facts. And everyone here looks like an American to me.
 
so truthbtold,

So do you have any links that show that the bay area has higher health care costs than the national average?

I provided links to a study that was shown in the SF Chronicle, LA Times, NY Times, Washington Post, that showed that the bay area had lower health care costs than the national average, even though the bay area has a large amount of immigrants.

Do you have any links that prove otherwise?

If not, be a man, sack up and accept the hard cold fact. Stop providing links to timothy mcveigh websites, because you are just showing your ignorance more and more by basing your arguments on shoddy links and no evidence.

your making the statement... so you post the articles. I'm not going to do YOUR research for you.

Jeez... can you believe this guy???
 
http://www.bayeconfor.org/pdf/HealthCareEmployerMandatesJan25.pdf


Bay Area health-care costs lead national increase
Silicon Valley / San Jose Business Journal


Total health benefit costs for active employees of surveyed Bay Area companies with more than 500 employees increased 13.5 percent in 2001 to an average of $5,480 per employee, compared to an increase of 11.2 percent for the national average. The national average spent per employee is $4,924. The Bay Area figures were gleaned from 47 large employers while the national figures included responses from more than 2,800 employers with at least 10 workers on the payroll.

The figures were released today by the consulting firm William M. Mercer Inc.

The national increase of 11.2 percent and the Bay Area's 13.5 percent hike come during a year in which general inflation has held to just 2.1 percent.

The picture for 2002 is no brighter: Employers expect their costs to rise by an average of 12.7 percent on a national basis and by 13 percent in the Bay Area, the Mercer study says.

Other points of the national survey are: Costs for health maintenance organizations are rising as fast as costs for less-managed preferred provider plans; a number of employers are dropping retiree medical plans; and prescription drug costs have abated slightly as employers redesign benefits.

Health benefit costs have been rising faster than inflation for the past four years, the Mercer study notes. But while unemployment was low and profits high, employers moved slowly, if at all, to share increases with employees. While the average dollar amount that employees contribute to the cost of coverage (through payroll deductions) has risen over the past few years, the percentage they pay has not -- meaning that employers have been absorbing the lion's share of cost increases. Deductible and copayment amounts have remained relatively flat as well.

But at the end of 2000, with the economy slowing down, the smaller, more vulnerable employers took steps to shift more costs to employees in 2001.

Although there was no significant cost shifting among large employers in 2001, it's clearly on the way, says the study. Responding to the survey in the summer of 2001, 40 percent of large employers said they would require employees to pay a higher percentage of total cost in the upcoming year. Over a third said they would raise deductibles, copayments, or out-of-pocket maximums.

Blaine Bos, a consultant with Mercer and one of the study's authors, says there are no realistic expectations that the double-digit trend will abate over the next few years -- "not with all those aging baby boomers still working. Unless a new silver bullet materializes -- like managed care in the 90s -- this rising tide may become a full-fledged flood."

The Mercer/Foster Higgins National Survey of Employer-sponsored Health Plans is the largest and most comprehensive annual survey of its kind, with over 2,800 respondents in 2001, Mercer says. Mercer used a national probability sample of public and private employers and weighted the results to reflect the demographics of all employers in the U.S. with 10 or more employees that offer health coverage. Therefore, the survey results represent about 600,000 employers and over 90 million full- and part-time employees, it says.

http://www.bayeconfor.org/pdf/HealthCareEmployerMandatesJan25.pdf
 
^ that is 2001.

my article is from 2005. Here let me print it out for you again.


The Bay Area is among the most affordable places in the country to buy individual health insurance, according to a survey released Wednesday. San Jose, San Francisco and Oakland tied for fifth place among the 50 largest cities in the country for lowest-cost insurance, with an average premium of $58 a month, according to a study by eHealthInsurance Services Inc., a Mountain View Internet health insurance broker.

here is more:


In other states, including California, many individuals with histories of health problems are either rejected or offered expensive premiums. That makes insurance cheaper for the young and healthy. In all, seven of the eight most- affordable cities were in California, despite the fact that the state's cost of living is high in many other respects.
 
^ your article doesnt' support anything you say.

It actually calls for universal health care coverage and says that undocumented workers who will get no health care will suffer under universal health care coverage proposals.

if you want to talk about California losing money, look at all the federal taxes going to other states, like Mississippi and Tennessee. California gives red states 80 Billion a year in federal taxes taht it never gets back.

That is enough to give everyone in California free health insurance, or send everyone in Calfornai to a UC or a Cal State for free if we stop funding red states who are the real blood suckers.

In the end the US doesn't have much to export. Most of US exports are made by immigrants. Look at textiles, apparel, technology, education etc... are the only real American exports and those are dominated by immigrant Americans. The bigger worry for America is those blood sucking red states that take all of our federal tax money and spit on California in return.

They take $80 Billion a year out of California. We can all have health insurance for free or go to Cal State or UC for free if it wasn't for the blood sucking red states. Thats my view, and I can back it up with a lot more facts than you can back up yours. Im pro-California, are you?
 
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^ your link doesn't work.

then type it in long hand, it works for me.

You are just a headline reader, if you dive deeper into the story you would see that the crisis is for the employers who are covering the lions share of the cost because they are forced too. Health care is VERY expensive- who do you think is footing the bill? Have you noticed how many corporations have been chased out of business unfriendly California?
 
It actually calls for universal health care coverage and says that undocumented workers who will get no health care will suffer under universal health care coverage proposals.

if you want to talk about California losing money, look at all the federal taxes going to other states, like Mississippi and Tennessee. California gives red states 80 Billion a year in federal taxes taht it never gets back. Look at the federal balance of payments when it comes to taxes paid vs. federal services received. California gets robbed by Wyoming and Kentucky EVERY YEAR. 80 BILLION

That is enough to give everyone in California free health insurance, or send everyone in Calfornai to a UC or a Cal State for free if we stop funding red states who are the real blood suckers.

In the end the US doesn't have much to export. Most of US exports are made by immigrants. Look at textiles, apparel, technology, education etc... are the only real American exports and those are dominated by immigrant Americans. The bigger worry for America is those blood sucking red states that take all of our federal tax money and spit on California in return.

They take $80 Billion a year out of California. We can all have health insurance for free or go to Cal State or UC for free if it wasn't for the blood sucking red states. Thats my view, and I can back it up with a lot more facts than you can back up yours. Im pro-California, are you?
 
^ well okay i will look it up. but remember this too, mcdonald's in europe is 15 dollars for a big mac meal. here in america its 5 bucks. there's one reason why its so low. because workers are willing to work for such low wages not only at mcdonalds, but on farms, trucks, supply chains, etc...

jeez. every day i save money so i can buy my gf stuff or save up for a house or something. i don't want to pay 15 dollars for a big mac meal.
 
again you have to separate LEGAL from ILLEGAL. let's bring in labor help legally!

Maybe you save a few dollars on a sandwich, but you are paying a lot more in taxes... the great money shuffle.
 
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I'm not very big on disclosing too much personal information on the web.
what do you mean, is this so much a personal information...com'on I was just wondering what kind of ethnic is that guy that talks that way about imigrants....but if you dont want to...no prob...what ever
 
what do you mean, is this so much a personal information...com'on I was just wondering what kind of ethnic is that guy that talks that way about imigrants....but if you dont want to...no prob...what ever


my grandfather is from ITALY.

ILLEGAL immigrants, again I am not against LEGAL immigration.
 
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